Wid's 180 and FW 190

[WIDDOG]

I am reducing the size of the kit to make it a Peanut Sized model. I do buy the plans from Guillow's. They do have a ten dollar min charge on their supplies. I always find great things I need from Guillow's so I think the min charge is very fair.

I take the plans sheet to a Copy/Print store here in town. I reduced it to 65% of the original size. Now as far as wood goes; I'm not complaining; It's just that I am very picky about the wood. I have not tried the Laser Cut stuff. I have heard that it is good stuff though. Anyway reducing the size definitely saves me on my wood usage.

[Bill Gaylord]

Looks like you'll have a little 16" version. People definitely don't take advantage of the opportunity to rescale plans like they could. I've done a few rescaled Guillows builds in the past. I still have the Chipmunk kit, bought for the plans that were rescaled and built to around 32". Since you like these small FF kits, I'd send it to you if you want it.

[Billy Mc]

I've been thinking of having a plan upscaled 150%, but not sure if a direct upscale will work well or will some mods be required.

[WIDDOG]

Hi Bill

Even though I'm a Noob at RC I have to give credit to your builds and posts. They are the best! Thanks for offering the Chipmunk plans. Your posts are so good seems like I should be the one sending a plan.

I've been thinking of having a plan upscaled 150%, but not sure if a direct upscale will work well or will some mods be required.

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I don't know much about upscaling. I have, in the past, downscaled a couple of 900 Series kits. It really worked out nicely. One of the reasons I downscale is because my flying field is so small.


http://youtu.be/E0bTMb7ErrA

[WIDDOG]

I recently purchased a Comet P 38 kit from Ebay. It has a 34 inch wing span. I am hoping to reduce the plans in half. This build is kind of a practice for the Comet P 38 build.

Anyway am making progress with this build. I have the tail rough framed. Everything seemed to fit ok.

[Wildpig]

WID do yourself a favor and maybe even the rest of the modeling community. Photocopy your balsa sheets for that Comet P-38 before you cut any parts. It certainly will come in handy later. Comet did not put the templates on the plans like Guillow's does. I have that Comet kit, it's kind of a pain to build, too.

[WIDDOG]

Thanks for the great advice Wildpig.

I found the Comet P 38 on Outerzone. http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_files_0 ... _comet.pdf Looks like a good copy with the parts sheet also printed and printed in scale with the plans sheet.

I also have some old kits that I have built by using copies and not the kit contents. I've built the Sterling Peanut Corsair about 3 times now and the kit looks as good as new. I even know how to make copies of the canopies.

I really like the way Guillow's does there plans sheet. Also I like the fact that it is so easy to order separate parts i.e. canopies.
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[zoomie]

I've been thinking of having a plan upscaled 150%, but not sure if a direct upscale will work well or will some mods be required.

If building light is important, upscaling usually beats downscaling. Upscaling from Peanut or Dime Scale size means you'll end up with an enlarged plan with a light structure that will most likely trim out and fly well with no mods required. 150% is not too extreme in most cases, a 13" Peanut would blow up to about 19"- 20" and you could use the same wood sizes and structure as specified on the Peanut plan.

When you want a model of around 24" wingspan or larger is when to consider larger wood sizes and added structure like more formers and ribs. That might be a good time to consider downscaling from a larger plan because you wouldn't have to work out additional structure locations, etc.

You can learn a lot by comparing different size plans of the same model to see how the wood sizes and structure is different.


zoomie

[WIDDOG]

This is kind of a practice build I'm doing to get ready for the Comet P 38 kit. I will reduce the Comet P 38 kit 50%. With the Peanut Cessna 180 build I am using 1/16 inch thick wood. The experiment is to see if the Peanut will fly with 1/16 inch thick wood? If it does I will use 1/16 inch thick wood on the P 38. I will not be using lightening techniques on the Cessna 180 build. I will however try to keep the P 38 as light as possible.

[Wildpig]

I should have guessed that somewhere online there is a source for those templates. My Comet P-38 kit was from the mid 1980's. Just printwood, not die cut. It was tough, hard balsa. I honestly thought about using a miniature jigsaw to cut out those balsa parts.

[WIDDOG]

I remember how difficult it really was to cut out the parts of a Comet model kit. Than once the part was cut out putting in the notches. When I would try and cut out a notch the whole piece would split apart. I understand that due to the nature of kit wood it is kind of up to the draw if the builder gets "Good" wood or not.

Awhile ago i head a rumor... That Guillow's was going to start to mill it's own Balsa wood. I used to buy my wood from A2Z Corp....( Wow did they have "Good" wood). I'm looking for a place that sells 1/20 th inch thick sheet and stringers. Anyway the rumor also said that Guillow's was going to get into the Balsa supply business.

[Mitch]

I have 2 points...

1. When I have a kit with print wood I make photocopies before I cut out the parts. That way I have a reference for the future.
2. Cutting notches. I will cut them out a bit small, then enlarge them with my dremel tool. Or just mark with pencil and as I lay in the stringer cut the notches at that time.

Here is the tool I use. It is probably designed for sanding but it cuts the balsa with no problem.


Mitch

[Billy Mc]

I've been thinking of having a plan upscaled 150%, but not sure if a direct upscale will work well or will some mods be required.

If building light is important, upscaling usually beats downscaling. Upscaling from Peanut or Dime Scale size means you'll end up with an enlarged plan with a light structure that will most likely trim out and fly well with no mods required. 150% is not too extreme in most cases, a 13" Peanut would blow up to about 19"- 20" and you could use the same wood sizes and structure as specified on the Peanut plan.

When you want a model of around 24" wingspan or larger is when to consider larger wood sizes and added structure like more formers and ribs. That might be a good time to consider downscaling from a larger plan because you wouldn't have to work out additional structure locations, etc.

You can learn a lot by comparing different size plans of the same model to see how the wood sizes and structure is different.


zoomie

The plane I was planning to upscale is the 602 Super Cub. It has a 20" wingspan so 150% would get me a 30" wingspan. I'm thinking I may need to add some formers and ribs to make everything hold shape. Then do some scalloping and hollow the ribs to reduce weight. Maybe the 303 Super Cub with it's 24" wingspan scaled 125% for a 30" span would work better. Maybe I'll get one and compare the plans.

[Bill Gaylord]

I don't hear this stated much, but the simplest method for lightening is to use light, contest grade wood. A good grade of contest 3/32" sheet can easily weigh less than your average 1/32" sheet. I built a 30" heavy built up construction ME109 using ultra light 1/16", 3/32", and 1/8" sheet, that was easily as light as a framed up 400 series Guillows kit, using the kit supplied wood, and this 109 has a LOT of wood. If you actually work out the percentage reduction, it's difficult to reduce the area of any part by more than 30%, and even at that it will either appear to have been hit by a 12 gauge shotgun, or simply appear to have very little structure left, that becomes delicate. It's usually easy to find stock that is 30% lighter than whatever you have, unless you already have really light, contest grade wood.

[zoomie]

I don't hear this stated much, but the simplest method for lightening is to use light, contest grade wood.

Do you have a reliable M.O. supplier that can be counted on to send you exactly that? And if not, do you have a local supplier that will allow you to bring a digital scale to weigh the sheets you're interested in?

I built a 30" heavy built up construction ME109 using ultra light 1/16", 3/32", and 1/8" sheet, that was easily as light as a framed up 400 series Guillows kit, using the kit supplied wood, and this 109 has a LOT of wood.

Interesting. I'm wondering how well it would stand up under less than ideal outdoor conditions, such as a sudden unexpected wind gust sending it into a spin. Or maybe a cartwheel landing on rocky ground?

Hey, I might want to build one someday . It's just that I have my doubts about the durability of a 30" wingspan heavy built-up FF model using ultra-light wood exclusively in the construction.


zoomie