Advice for First Build

[HLM]

Hello there,

I am building a Guillow's balsa model for the first time and looking for some advice. I have chosen to build the #508 Stuka kit. Not only have I never attempted a flying model before, I have never so much as worked with wood and such before. Nor paint now that I think about it..
I would ultimately like a nice looking painted model that I can at least attempt to fly under rubber power.

I have so far made what I think is decent progress for my first attempt, but I have a few questions both general and specific to this model. Since I am most comfortable following instructions exactly, I get concerned when I have to guess how to fit a certain piece since it's not shown on the diagram...

So, I'd appreciate if anyone could offer some assistance with the following:


General
1) When it comes to covering the model, I've seen some people use dope, a mixture of glue/water, and glue sticks. What would you recommend?
2) Would I be better off spray painting or painting with brushes? Do I need any kind of primer, or do I paint the colour right on after the covering as above?
3) What is the best way to mask parts of the model when using different colours for camouflage? Would masking tape not tear the tissue covering?

Stuka-Specific
1) Do the dive flaps, tail wheel and other small parts require covering, or can I paint straight on these?
2) On the underside of the fuselage, I seem to have a few unused slots in formers B1, 2 and 4 where stringers should be. I'm guessing B1 and B2 connect to eachother but I'm not sure about B4. I have been using scigs30's excellent build as a guide and he seems to have attached one end of the stringer that runs most the length to the edge of the curved A6 part (see image). This leaves me with 2 unused slots on the very bottom of the former

Thanks for any help you can provide.
Here are a few pictures of my progress as of a few days ago (click to see full size);






Note - You'll likely notice a few broken pieces here and there from following the instructions and trying to cut the notches with a knife and snapping and crushing everything. I since learned of the sanding method and got much better results!

[Goldy]

You're going to get a lot of differing responses to your questions. But speaking for myself, I prefer to use 50/50 furniture glue and water as an adhesive when covering with tissue; gives you plenty of time to work with it. If it's your first time cover it in smaller sections. I use dope to seal the tissue and as a primer before painting...you will have to sand the bare wood and recoat it at least once to get a smooth painted finish. I use a brush to paint these smaller models.
Don't overdo it with the paint if you want it to fly...every gram counts.
Don't worry too much about areas where things appear to me missing, there are often parts that go in those little slots after assembly...after the framework is all assembled and ready for tissue you can fill in any gaps with left over scrap balsa.
Looks like you are doing great so far!
Best of luck,
Goldy

[Billy Mc]

This is the easiest way I have found to do camo.
http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/tes/tes4034.htm

[Wildpig]

HLM,
Honestly, you've done a great job assembling your model. The structure looks straight and true.

The flaps that run along the trailing edge of the wings require covering. The plastic dive flaps, under the wings, can be painted as is.

The stringers on this model are a bit confusing if you ask me. The stringer running to the end of A6 is where most modelers attach it. However, I think the original intent was for the stringer to go to the bottom of B4.
This leaves you with covering the curvature of the fuselage between B4 and B5 without any stringer underneath. Which is how I built the Stuka. It can be done and look o.k. There is also some ambiguity of where to place stringers on B1 and B2. I did mine slightly different than the profile view on the plans.
I have several pictures that I can upload. When I get a chance, I'll see what I can do for answers.


I see the imagshack photo you have. The two X's at the bottom of B1, go to B2 and stop.
(I got to thinking, I wonder if those two bottom stringers were meant to go all the way to B4 after the wing is installed??? I'll check my model when I get home.)

I did my stringer from B1,B2 to A6 a little different. I'll try to get a photo posted when I go to lunch.

[Wildpig]

As for covering....
I use UHU stick glue or some kind of stick glue to attach the tissue to the balsa. Then spray clear acrylic over the finished model.
There are a variety of methods, all will work. Each has it's own plus and minuses. Whichever suits you the builder is what counts.

[Mitch]

HLM,

Welcome to our wonderful world of building and flying small scale replicas... I see you already got some good advice, but I will give you my 2 cents...

Dope is the traditional way to adhere the paper and seal the paper. Some people are having a hard time to find Dope these days. I now use a glue stick to rub on the edges of the contact area to adhere the paper. I use colored paper, as that way I do not need paint. I also now starting using TopFlite spray Luster Coat to seal the paper. If you are going to paint, you will still NEED to seal the paper.

If you are going to paint, (and some flyers do) I would suggest using an airbrush. If you do not have one, then I would suggest using the "rattle" cans. Use as little paint as needed, as you are adding weight that does nothing for flying ability of the model...

Good Luck, and Good Flying... Mitch

[joecrouse]

looking good

First filling in the gaps and sanding out the rough spots

Superglue and extra balsa are your friend... some of my models have looked like PINCUSSIONS while filling in the little spaced between stringer and former.

2 The stuka model is probably the most difficult plane in the series and you did a heck of a job on it. It however is not know to be a good flier. If you get it to fly you already are ahead of most folks.


3 covering.
primer the plane with the balsa wood primer you should find it at your Local hobby shop .
then use an Elmers glue stick (the purple stuff that dries clear) is a good start to coat the stringers that you are working on covering
If you are using the kit covering that came with the kit, use smaller pieces and trim them. If you use some OTHER tissue paper
Use large pieces and wet them first . (see examples from Sigs30 to how to cover with wet tissue)

[HLM]

Thanks for the replies so far. It's very encouraging to hear I'm not making as much of a mess as I thought!
I will take some pictures later today once my camera batteries are charged. I had already sanded everything down nice and smooth before creating this thread and just finishing up the landing gear. Just one more set of flaps to make and then I think I'm ready for covering.

The flaps that run along the trailing edge of the wings require covering. The plastic dive flaps, under the wings, can be painted as is.

It was the small under-wing dive flaps (which are also made from balsa pieces) I was talking about. That's what I needed to know, thanks.

I see the imagshack photo you have. The two X's at the bottom of B1, go to B2 and stop.
(I got to thinking, I wonder if those two bottom stringers were meant to go all the way to B4 after the wing is installed??? I'll check my model when I get home.)
I did my stringer from B1,B2 to A6 a little different. I'll try to get a photo posted when I go to lunch.

Haha, I decided against posting that image for some reason, but you found it anyway. That is actually a picture of scigs30's Stuka that I borrowed and wrote on. (link)
The B1-B2 stringers are easy enough and are as I expected. It's just it's not mentioned anywhere on the plan, so I wasn't sure.
I also wondered the same thing about stringers running from B1-B4, but realised it would block the wing. however I did not consider adding them after mounting the wing!

Regarding dope, glue and other supplies;
I live in New Zealand and so probably won't have the same products you are all familiar with. I have only a couple of places locally where I can get supplies, but there is always the internet. I'd just rather see what I have available physically on the shelf.
I have so far not been able to find the purple glue sticks that everyone talks about, nor anywhere selling dope.

So assume I am not able to use the dope method. I'll be using the kit-provided tissue. I first stick the tissue down with glue (stick or 50/50 white glue/water) and let dry. I spray a bit of water to shrink it and dry again. Would I then get straight to putting my colour on, or is there another step before that?

[Billy Mc]

When you shrink the wings pin them flat or they may warp. I would seal the wings with a couple light spray coats (just a misting) of your base color or clear to start. To heavy at the start and the tissue can sag and if the paint dries before the tissue shrinks it will remain sagged.

[zoomie]

HLM,

Would suggest a mix of 3 parts PVA/white glue and 2 parts water for your tissue adhesive, applied with a small artists brush. This ratio doesn't sink into the wood as quickly as the 50/50 mix sometimes does, and gives adequate working time. Glue sticks are sometimes too dry to stick the tissue down well.

Sand the balsa surfaces where the tissue gets stuck down with very fine sandpaper and blow off all the balsa dust, then apply the glue mix to one area at a time. Cover, smooth down the edges and set it aside to dry thoroughly. Repeat with another area, and so on until entire model is covered.

Do not shrink the tissue until you are positive that all the tissue adhesive is completely dry. Use a fine mist, spray it up in the air and let it fall onto the various parts of the model. It doesn't take much, no need to drown the thing .

Good luck with it!


zoomie

[Wildpig]

I was unable to get around to post pictures. Yesterday, was a bad day here at work. But, I think you've got it figured out anyway. Looking forward to completion pictures of your model.

[Mitch]

HLM,

I see some Guillow (maybe all) kits are coming with a slip of paper for "Safe Dope Alternative..." They suggest brushing 50/50 white glue/water. Brush on contact area. Apply paper and brush a bit more on though the paper to get a good bond. After shrinking with water, a couple of light coats of Clear acrylic spray paint. I would do that first and then spray with color last.

Mitch

[HLM]

HLM,

I see some Guillow (maybe all) kits are coming with a slip of paper for "Safe Dope Alternative..." They suggest brushing 50/50 white glue/water. Brush on contact area. Apply paper and brush a bit more on though the paper to get a good bond. After shrinking with water, a couple of light coats of Clear acrylic spray paint. I would do that first and then spray with color last.

Mitch

Thanks for the advice Mitch.
I don't recall seeing the slip of paper you mentioned. The only slip of paper I got was one talking about mounting gas engines. Perhaps they only come with the newer laser-cut kits?

I'll definitely be going with the glue/water method as these seems more popular these days and is more readily available.

I think I'm now ready to take the plunge and begin the covering and painting process and will hopefully get started on the weekend. I'm just going to need some glue, paints, airbrush...

I did take some photos last night but forgot to upload them!

[davidchoate]

very nice. even if it was not your first build; still nice. wait till you try a 400 series. you will love it !

[stx44]

Some of the 900 series kits come with a pamphlet, and in that it recomends the 50/50 glue/water for doping, and for gluing tissue to the frame.

I have tried it for doping, and found that it shrinks a lot, and is also susceptable to moisture (eg dew or foggy mornings), which will make is slightly saggy and wrinkly.

I use a papermate glue stick for covering. The Americans will recomend UHU, but their mix is different to ours in oz/nz . I use papermate as it works the same and is slighly softer, hence less pressure on the airframe. As ours are all water based, make sure you let it thoroughly dry (like overnight) before spraying with water to do the initial shrink.

I dispense with doping, and go straight to a coat of acrylic. I brush on as I dont have an airbrush. If its a vintage plane I dont want coloured, I simply use clear coat.

I generally use games workshop paints, partly because they are a good quality paint, and partly because Im a mad keen wargamer and have a huge stock of them.